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Post by blueboy Fri Mar 20, 2015 9:58 am

We all know that with Lampard and possibly Milner leaving in the summer - and talks of another LB needed, so maybe even Clichy going, we need youth and definitely English youth.

At the moment there are quite a few players who are currently coming towards the end of their contracts that 'may' decide to jump ship if the wages were right. As we know, paying top salaries isn't a problem for us and with FFP restrictions being lifted, nor should it be.

This summer isn't the time to be worrying about paying slightly over the odds for quality players, or paying them £150-200k pw.

We'll no doubt have a big clear out in the summer and some of those may be our top end earners. I'n not sure who will go or how much exactly they earn pw, but for example:

TLMLF - £220k
Nasri - £150k
Lampard - £150k
Dzeko - £120k
Jovetic - £100k
Milner - £100k

The following English players are currently stalling on new contracts:

Walcott - would want parity with Ozil and Sanchez on £140k +.....wouldn't be a problem, as Lampard and Nasri will be on more than that.

Sterling - will be offered in the region of £120k at Liverpool. He would earn a lot more than that at other big clubs - £150k wouldn't an issue and talk of a £50m price tag.

Then we have Ings - though to be fair, he's not a player we should be even looking at. But he'd be cheap and £60k pw would secure his services.

Berahino - same as Ings.

Clyne - £25m would probably secure his services and a salary of £60k pw wouldn't be a problem.

Then we have the likes of Cresswell and Kane....if we wanted to try and tempt them away.

The problem we have with these young players, is that we have an awful record when it comes to signing younger players - then not playing them regularly - Johnson, Sinclair, Rodwell.....granted, there were issues with fitness and form. Therefore, to get English youth, they'd have to be seriously good and be of a quality that would see them get regular football.
Out of these, the only one's that would possibly get that is Sterling and Walcott. I really can't see many of the other getting a regular game in our first 11.

To compliment this, we need top, top quality players for our starting 11.

Once again, wages are not going to be a problem and the fact that we could offer £200k pw+...may be in our favour:

Pogba - the fee and wages wouldn't be an issue. £70m and £220k pw would dwarf his current contract.

We're then looking at another top class striker, left back, attacking midfielder as a minimum, or consider selling Mangala and bring in another CB.

We can add 3 or 4 of the academy players to the squad - and suddenly, our HG quota is increased and the age of the team significantly reduces closer to 23-25 yrs.
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Post by shakencity Fri Mar 20, 2015 10:30 am

Bale and Barkley can be thrown into the mix too, although Barkley could prove to be another Rodwell, but i think he'd be ok if managed right.

Clyne would be the only one i'd go for, as Walnutt's always injured and i can't stand Sterling.

Kane wouldn't come, as he's just signed a new contract and i don't think Ings/Berahino are good enough....but they may be good fits for the HG quota.
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Post by blueboy Fri Mar 20, 2015 10:49 am

I didn't add Barkley, purely in the hope we got Pogba, but yes, he'd be another.

I just don't see Bale wanting to come to us...but he'd be great.
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Post by shakencity Fri Mar 20, 2015 10:53 am

But if Yaya, Nasri, Lampard and Milner all left, there'd definitely be a need for both Barkley and Pogba.

The thing is blue, whether they want to come or not we have to try and get them...and if that means spending big, then so be it.
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Post by blueboy Fri Mar 20, 2015 11:06 am

Exactly....like I said, with no restrictions comes no excuses.

IF, there will be a massive clear our (which is definitely needed), then we could potentially have £200m+ to spend.

Therefore, we could spend £170m on 2 players - Bale and Pogba, but that then leaves limited money to fill potentially, 4 more places.

I know Melton posted something yesterday about how many players we could get for a certain amount with amortisation.

If we take the following players and even add the likes of Navas:

TLMLF - £25m?
Nasri - £25m?
Lampard - £0
Dzeko - £20m?
Jovetic - £20m?
Milner - £0
Navas - £15m?


That's £110m. Add that to a potential £120m we could have to spend and that's £230m


Would it be prudent to spend £170m on 2 players?


Or would it be better to spend £100m on 1 player and bring in 3/4 more £30m+ players....but will they really be of a quality to strengthen the first team?


That's why I think a better option would be as follows:


£70m for Pogba
£50m for Sterling
£35m for Walcott
£50m for a top striker
£30m for a top LB/defender


The team could feasibly end up looking something like this:


..................................Hart................................


Zaba.................Vinny............Mangala..............LB


Walcott.................Pogba........Silva...........Sterling


...................Aguero..........£50m striker................
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Post by shakencity Fri Mar 20, 2015 11:16 am

Completely valid blue, but I'd personally spend the Walnutt and Sterling money on trying to get Bale....surely we could find a RMer from somewhere Laughing
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Post by Topdawg Fri Mar 20, 2015 11:23 am

Not a bad team Blue, but I don't like the look of our central defence. CL qualification is immensely important as that worth probably over £100M (new tv deal, prize money, gate receipts, sponsorships etc.).

As I said yesterday, the increase in tv deal and, if Etihad goes up to £80M, we'll have an extra £70M to spend anyway. Selling players could be worth around £100M and we'd have about £60M to spend anyway.

We've got bundles of money. Messi won't come (especially after Wednesday night) so we have to go down the list and get the next best thing we can and I think that is Bale.
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Post by blueboy Fri Mar 20, 2015 11:50 am

I'd love Bale to come and he'd cost in the region of £80-100m....I just can't see him coming to us. If anything, I can see the rags paying top whack for him in the summer if he decides to move....or even Chelsea for that matter.

I think with United's money and LVG in situ, they and Chelsea are far better propositions for the likes of Bale. I sadly fear that this season has lessened our attractiveness for the top players.

Pogba knows Manchester - and would probably love a little dig at United by coming to us.

So, unless the likes of Busquets, Pedro or Ramos/Varane/Coentrao want to move.....who else is on the radar for top, top quality players who we could be in for?

Messi, Suarez, Neymar, Ronaldo, Ibrahimovich....all will stay put.

I just don't see us getting any big names of these like.

DeBruyne would be a good option for £35m. 

OK, let's say this then. We get Coentrao, Pogba, DeBruyne and Sterling.
That's approx £180m. We could feasibly still look at Hummels for another £35m if a CB is a problem.

...................................Hart.......................................

Zaba...............Vinny................Hummels.............Coentrao

Sterling...........Pogba................Silva...............DeBruyne

.........................Aguero...........Bony.............................

That's without signing 2 more strikers and letting Jovetic and Dzeko go.

You could possibly go with 1 up front or play 4-3-3 and drop Bony:

.....................................Hart........................................

Zaba...................Vinny...................Hummels.........Coentrao

.............DeBruyne............Pogba...........Fernandinho............

Sterling...........................Aguero.....................Silva..........

It would bring the age of the first team down slightly, but not by a huge amount.


Last edited by blueboy on Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:15 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Post by Topdawg Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:25 pm

Surely that'll bring the average age down by 2-3 years. Hummels is 8 years younger than Dimi, Coentrao is 2 years younger than Clichy, Pogba is 9 years younger than Yaya, de Bruyne is 6 years younger than Navas and Sterling is 9 years younger than Dzeko. That's bang on 3 years lower.

I still think we should go all out for Bale as you haven't bought too many HG in that list of purchases.
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Post by skyblueoz Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:41 pm

Cant understand why we don't keep clichy.  (a)Better than Kolarov (b) homegrown player (c) Kolarov signed new contract so a fee would be due & seems Italian clubs willing to pay good money for him.

No to Walcott surely we have had enough of sicknotes what's the point of having homegrown on the treatment table? cant help us on the pitch from there.

Hummels or Subotic would do for me. Pogba a yes, If Madrid keep Bale then Isco is the player we should go all out for. Use Milner as part of the sterling transfer if he wont sign a new deal, I know he is out of contract but isn't Sterling also?

De bruyne for navas seems a good shout . Cavani available still a darn sight better than Jovetic & Dzeko. If a new coach in I would give Richards one last crack to prove himself.
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Post by leopold Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:58 pm

skyblueoz wrote:Cant understand why we don't keep clichy.  (a)Better than Kolarov (b) homegrown player (c) Kolarov signed new contract so a fee would be due & seems Italian clubs willing to pay good money for him.
I think we should keep him, too. Ditch Kolarov and bring in someone else at LB to complement Clichy.

No sense in ditching a HG player if that's where we're so short. Especially since he's been our best defender this season. Mind, that said, we ditched a decent CB in Lescott and decent DCMs in De Jong, Garcia (yeah, yeah, I know, but he's still streets ahead of Fernando) and Barry...

I think I was making a point here... Oh, yes. Don't ditch Clichy.
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Post by meltonblue Fri Mar 20, 2015 1:06 pm

I don't think Pogba and silva will work in a midfield two with attacking players on the wing too. That's even less foundation than we have now and we would get killed in midfield.

Pogba with Fernandinho would work, with Silva, Aguero and two others. Reus or Isco (or both) would be my choices. Sterling would be an option too, but I can't see it happening. From Liverpool and an English player, I actually think we could do with someone like Henderson.
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Post by leopold Fri Mar 20, 2015 1:12 pm

meltonblue wrote:From Liverpool and an English player, I actually think we could do with someone like Henderson.
I suspect this'll get some comments!!!!
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Post by blueboy Fri Mar 20, 2015 1:16 pm

Personally, I'd keep Clichy, but I just don't think he's a CL quality player....but definitely better than Kolorov.

I only added the LB position as it was mentioned. 

Reus would be a good shout.

Henderson - LFC's best player, won't move now he's practically the Captain, but yes, that mould....but who?

Agree with what you said about Pogba and Silva...that's why a possible formation change could accommodate fitter, younger players like DeBruyne.

We're desperately missing pace, but no wide pace, pace to get in beyond the CB's and to carry the ball quickly. Sterling would be ideal for that.

Would love Isco - but tbf, he's pretty much RM's number 2 player after Ronaldo....they love him there.

There's also Koke....who the Spanish media, in particular Graham Hunter says is an absolute shoe-in for the Spanish team, he's rated that highly.
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Post by Topdawg Fri Mar 20, 2015 1:39 pm

I think whoever we buy, we need at least two world class players.

Madrid can't keep all their attacking talent (Modric, Isco, Bale, Ronaldo, Benzema, James, Kroos, Kadeira, Silva, Illarramendi) for another season especially if they go and buy another big player as they seem to be doing every season.

Kroos and Rodriguez were bought last season and Di Maria and Morata had to go. The season before, they bought Bale, Illarramendi and Isco and sold Ozil and Higuain. 

I expect that they'll buy big again in the summer and that will mean someone had to move on and that could be a chance for us though I'm not happy getting their cast offs.

They are buying players that can walk into their first team each summer and some that would walk into just about any team elsewhere. We've got to be doing the same and not buying backups for who we already have. Willy was never going to displace Hart. He doesn't look good enough. I'd have preferred a much younger keeper who may have developed to displace Hart within a couple of years much the same way Hart displaced Given.
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Post by Topdawg Fri Mar 20, 2015 1:47 pm

From the MEN...

Kevin de Bruyne


English players...... JS58988351
Midfield, Wolfsburg, £35m
The Belgian didn’t look like a superstar when he left Chelsea for Wolfsburg in January of last year. The 23-year-old playmaker had made little impression at Stamford Bridge and didn’t look like forcing his way into Jose Mourinho’s plans.
Little over a year on and he’s one of the most sought-after players in Europe.
A creator and scorer of goals, he is the complete package.
If Toure departs this summer City are going to need to make up the shortfall in goals. De Bruyne will do that. And even at £35m, he represents a cheaper option than other targets on City’s radar.
Potential stumbling blocks are Wolfsburg’s intention to keep their prize asset for at least another season – and Paris St Germain’s attempts to beat City to his signature.

Paul Pogba


English players...... JS57317620
Midfield, Juventus, £55m+
The Frenchman’s agent Mino Raiola claims it will take a world record fee to lure Pogba away from Turin – and with Real Madrid, Barcelona, City and Chelsea among his suitors, he might just be right.
Juventus would struggle to resists anything in excess of £55m for a player they signed for a nominal fee when he left Manchester United as a free agent in 2012.
Since then he has established himself as one of the world’s outstanding midfielders.
Blessed with power, balance, touch, awareness and the ability to score from midfield, it is little wonder Europe’s biggest clubs are pursuing him.
The 22-year-old would bring strength and guile to City’s midfield in the absence of Toure.
Paired with a De Bruyne or Ross Barkley, City would have a partnership to capable of making them serious contenders in the Champions League.

Ross Barkley


English players...... 4290561
Midfield, Everton, £30m+
Described by Roy Hodgson last summer as the nation’s latest obsession, Barkley has come down to earth in a season disrupted by injury. His form has suffered as a result, but there is no denying the natural talent that makes him such an exciting prospect.
City were unwilling to meet Everton’s £50m valuation last year - and it would be hard to argue that his stock has risen in that time.
The Premier League champions believe a fee closer to £30m is more realistic, so it will a case of whether a compromise can be reached over his price. De Bruyne might make more sense financially.

Gareth Bale


English players...... JS37599176
Winger, Real Madrid, £70m
Manchester United are determined to bring the Welshman back to the Premier League after a troubled campaign at the Bernabeu.
Sources in Spain claim Real will be willing to listen to offers for the world’s most expensive player - and Bale won’t be short of options, with Chelsea also linked.
The issue for City is two-pronged. Bale could add pace and dynamism to their attack. Like Sergio Aguero and Toure, he is a match-winner. But if they fail to land him they run the risk of seeing him significantly strengthen a rival like United or Chelsea.

Raheem Sterling


English players...... JS58350947
Forward, Liverpool, £40m+
As long as the England international’s new contract remains unsigned then suitors from around Europe will believe there is a chance of willing him away from Anfield.
Pellegrini specifically name-checked Sterling during a revealing interview this week. He claimed it would take a bid of £100m to land the 20-year-old. In reality it would take significantly less - especially if he continues to drive a hard bargain during contract negotiations.
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Post by Topdawg Fri Mar 20, 2015 1:49 pm

If those numbers are right, we could buy the lot but that still leaves us with a porous defence. Barkley is a bit of a risk with his injuries hampering his form this season.
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Post by blueboy Fri Mar 20, 2015 2:04 pm

The 2 out of them for me, would be Pogba and DeBruyne.

Stirling would be a realistic proposition if LFC don't want to pay him £140k pw......so getting these 3 would cost us in the region of £150m at the top end. That leaves us with a budget of approx £80m to improve the defence and add another striker.

I just can't see us getting Bale unfortunately....I can honestly see the rags going all out to get him.
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Post by Guest Fri Mar 20, 2015 2:10 pm

Interesting, are we 100% sure that Pogba counts as a home grown though?  How long was he with the rags and from what age?  Or has it gone from English players to any players?

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Post by Topdawg Fri Mar 20, 2015 2:19 pm

Apparently, Pogba needed another 3 months to count as HG. Too late now.
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Post by blueboy Fri Mar 20, 2015 2:43 pm

I never included Pogba as a HG anyway....I am purely talking about the 3 players out of those you posted that we could possibly get....we'd obviously have to add extra HG players as well.
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Post by meltonblue Fri Mar 20, 2015 3:12 pm

I agree Blueboy about Henderson, he personally wouldn't be a viable option, but that mould of player.
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