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City v Liverpool - Live Thread

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City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:50 am

First topic message reminder :

Massive game today. Think LFC have looked pretty devastating when they can get behind the back of teams, just like they did against Arsenal, albeit, Arsenal were garbage.

Mane and Salah will either need to be pushed back into their own half, or we have to give them no space wide and behind us. Watching the video with Phil Neville, he actually made a good point about our LB position and playing Danilo there, as he's right footed. When they cut inside, like they like to do, it'll be on to his right foot...so it may force them to go wider where they don't want to be.

Either way, Vinny being out, AGAIN, for a big match, will be a big miss.

Will Pep play Sergio and Jesus? Sergio has scored against LFC is his last 5 matches. Or, will he fill the MF and push them back, as LFC prefer to go inside and through the middle?

One things for sure, we MUST take any chances that come our way.

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Sun Sep 10, 2017 1:31 pm

PMSL 'we got it wrong' my arse.

You got it wrong. I like Rich's thinking that Pep got his tactics wrong.

Looking only at the final score Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Sun Sep 10, 2017 1:40 pm

We, as in you and Rich?Razz 

Both whining at beating LFC 5-0? 

Jesus, no pleasing some people!

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Paulpowersleftfoot on Sun Sep 10, 2017 2:17 pm

If you look at the game prior to the sending off I did  think tactically we were really exposed down the flank
It was a different game after they went down to 10 men
I'm not a really pep hater by any means I just find him a little stubborn which plays into the opposition hands at times
We got away with it yesterday but if Liverpool had been more clinical we could've been looking at another 1-4 from 2 seasons ago when Pellegrini has learnt the square root of fuck all in how to play against the counter attack

Always good to have opposite opinions to debate though blueboy as that's what a forum is for,no one is right or wrong on here unless we use the C bomb
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Sun Sep 10, 2017 4:22 pm

Otamendi had a terrible first half. Some of it was his own fault and some because he was up against a wide man that blitzed him for pace. But we all knew that would happen before the game. 

So what if we played a back 4 against Bournemouth? They aren't a team that are going to beat us down with 3 pacy attackers. Totally different game and tactics and opposition.
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Sun Sep 10, 2017 4:34 pm

Hey, I'm all for opinions Rich, I just take exception to persistent "I'm right, I posted this" posts. Not sure how it escalated to that point, as I said Otamendi didn't play well, so did Oz. Think Dawg just couldn't get his around the fact I said "I thought Pep got his tactics spot on"....you and he disagree, and that's fine by me, I just don't get the constant 'wanting to be right' approach.

As for Pep's tactics, why I said he got it spot on was for a few reasons. 

1. We had Vinny out injured and that meant either adding Walker as a RCB (which is what I said he might do), turns out Danilo was there which was a good move by Pep, or, bringing back Mangala as a left footer to play as the LCB. However, after only wanting to leave a week ago and pretty much not featuring this season, that would have been a greater risk, in my opinion.

The alternative, was to play Danilo as a LCB and Stones as a RCB, with Otamendi in the middle - but we're all great at seeing things after the event....which, on this occasion, was a 5-0 win!

Kompany has a lot to answer for in my humble opinion. He's missed nearly 2 years of football and Pep said he might not be able to play 2 games in a week, as they have him on a special training regime, which, up until the International window, had meant he played every minute of every game. He goes away and it's the same old same old.

2. With a back 4, that we deployed against Bournemouth, we looked pretty tame. We didn't even look that solid when you look at the game and the chances they had throughout (goal and hit the post to name 2). Furthermore, by playing a 4, means you drop one of Sergio or Jesus, which provides us with a less threatening attacking option, as the striker then faces 2 CB's who can pretty much look after him (where yesterday,  their 2 CB's struggled to cope with the runs of the two, even before the sending off - we were 1-0 up remember).

Also, deploying a 3 at the back, with Fernandinho or another sitting in front, makes their forward line press high, allowing further space behind in our MF to start quick attacks...a fact borne out yesterday with the numerous balls through by KDB and Silva.

3. Mendy as a wing back will take time. He's new to the PL and wouldn't have faced the attacking intent of teams like Bournemouth or Liverpool and then we have Spurs and United to come. He's used to playing in a league where defending in his position, really isn't warranted, but it's different in the PL.
He'll learn better, when to go and when to search out danger behind him - he'll have to, otherwise, Pep will drop him. He's absolutely brilliant going forward and has a pass to equal the best LWB in world football, but Pep will be wanting him to provide more cover for the LCB than he did yesterday....and I'm sure he'll learn from that experience in the first half.

4. Pep's not gonna change his approach. We all should know that. He wants possession and he wants his wing backs to go wide to stretch the play. That will inevitably lead to counter attacks from teams - something I guess we'll have to accept. Barca rarely kept a clean sheet when they were probably the best team EVER in world football, under Pep. He believes in what he thinks is the best way to play football, but it'll lead to heart-in-the-mouth moments during his tenure....but I for one, would rather see what we are seeing now and give it more time, than start reverting to a back 4 and see the frustrating keep ball, but no penetration football we saw at Bournemouth.

We tore LFC apart when they went down to 10 men. That was more to the style of play than poor tactics by Klopp. They just couldn't cope with us. Yet, when we went down to 10 men against EFC for 50 mins, they hardly had a touch of the ball and we created numerous chances, eventually getting an equaliser. 

I just think we have to accept what Pep does...and if at the end of the season, we've won nothing again, with all the players he's brought in, then I guess anyone is entitled to whine about it. But 5-0, against LFC.....ask yourself: yesterday morning, if that was offered to you, would you have taken it then, without complaints?

Very Happy


Last edited by blueboy on Sun Sep 10, 2017 4:42 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Sun Sep 10, 2017 4:40 pm

I think things escalated, as with others, because YOU think you are right and deride others. You go a little OTT with your 'banter'. And to quote me picking otamendi in my team ( but not mentioning that he was in my back 4) was rather naughty.
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Sun Sep 10, 2017 4:45 pm

Topdawg wrote:I think things escalated, as with others, because YOU think you are right and deride others. You go a little OTT with your 'banter'. And to quote me picking otamendi in my team ( but not mentioning that he was in my back 4) was rather naughty.
Hmmm...I didn't say anything until you went OTT with:

get a hold of yourself mate - you're coming across like a bitter.

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Sun Sep 10, 2017 4:46 pm

Then:

You've basically said something wrong and are now desperately trying to defend your comments rather than admit you are wrong.
  

Quite sad really.

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Sun Sep 10, 2017 4:47 pm

Then:

Sometimes you just talk too much shit bluey and are too one eyed to accept you're wrong.

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Sun Sep 10, 2017 4:51 pm

Maybe it was the:


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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Paulpowersleftfoot on Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:09 pm

I think we would have been better playing so the outside centre backs are quick enough to cope with the counterattacks and Walker/Fernandinho can always drop in to make a 4


Ederson
Stones Otamendi Mendy 
Fernandinho 
Walker DeBruyne Silva Silva
Jesus Aguero
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:42 pm

blueboy wrote:
Topdawg wrote:If otamendi is such a liability against pace, how did Pep get his tactics spot on?
He had no-one else.....really? Do I have to explain that to you?  Sleep
This is the start...
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:43 pm

blueboy wrote:
Topdawg wrote:Oh and I did predict a handsome city win in the prediction league
It's not all about you, or you, or you, or you....or whichever one of your alias' predicted the game score.... Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz
After you asked who predicted a city win in the PL.

Just banter if you hadn't have posted the one before
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:45 pm

blueboy wrote:Huh? That makes no sense whatsoever. Re-read and come back with another 'hole-digger'.... Razz Razz Razz Razz

He made the right sub at the right time with Ota. Why keep a player on the pitch when you're winning 3-0 who could get a random other yellow card? Makes no sense whatsoever.....and he wasn't playing against Mane, Salah and Firmino for more than 50 mins.

What's EFC got to do with today's performance by Otamendi? He didn't get sent off or dive in for Calvert-Lewin's pull back for Rooney's goal - WHAT HAS THAT GOT TO DO WITH ANYTHING???

He was poor today. He was exposed and got found out. He gave away another stupid free kick for diving in...but what's to say Mangala wouldn't have done that? He was left without Kompany, so he's hardly gonna put a player in for the LFC game who wanted a move to Inter just over a week ago!!

Now....stop digging, build a bridge...and you know the next bit.  Wink
another great post...
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:45 pm

and then i start...
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:47 pm

It was ALL banter....you just see your arse if anyone pulls you up on anything. 

I couldn't really give a shit if someone thinks I'm right or wrong....but it does make me laugh, laughing at your OCD over your own posts.  Razz Razz Razz

It's like a red rag to a bull. Laughing


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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:50 pm

Paulpowersleftfoot wrote:I think we would have been better playing so the outside centre backs are quick enough to cope with the counterattacks and Walker/Fernandinho can always drop in to make a 4


Ederson
Stones Otamendi Mendy 
Fernandinho 
Walker DeBruyne Silva Silva
Jesus Aguero

Yep, in hindsight, maybe Otamendi would have been better in the middle of a 3, but then that means we lose Stones' quick balls out from the back..like yesterday. None of this would have mattered if we got Jonny Evans.  affraid

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by leopold on Mon Sep 11, 2017 11:43 am

Otamendi, in the dead centre of defense? Penalty and red card waiting to happen, that...
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Moonchester on Mon Sep 11, 2017 12:21 pm

anywhere on the pitch he is often a red card waiting to happen.
He does have some good games, just not enough to fill me with confidence in the long run..

Other than being skinned by Salah and bringing him down, and playing Mane onside for kung-fu-academy run he didn't have too much to do himself. he was exposed by Mendy playing very advanced, which was always the danger with Liverpools quick counter threat.
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 12:23 pm

TBF...we all say it, but when was the last time Otamendi gave a penalty away or was sent off?

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by skyblueoz on Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:15 pm

I don't know if many saw the Salah nutmeg on Otamendi but to be fair to Otamendi it was a total miskick from Salah that nutmegged Otamendi. Had he connected cleanly with the ball the chances are Otamendi would have made the tackle & not been yellow carded. I guess we will never know but he still had a shit game regardless.
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by ManCityMan on Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:16 pm

blueboy wrote:TBF...we all say it, but when was the last time Otamendi gave a penalty away or was sent off?
Probably more by luck than good judgement, but to be fair he was a disaster waiting to happen in his first season but he has settled down to a more reliable overall consistency particularly when with VK.
However, his lack of pace and the ability for fast paced players to roast him when a long ball over the top catches him out is still a problem that needs to be addressed.
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:33 pm

Think you hit the nail on the head MCM. It's his lack of pace that lets him down and leaves us exposed if the full backs don't protect him when in a 3.

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:47 pm

blueboy wrote:Think you hit the nail on the head MCM. It's his lack of pace that lets him down and leaves us exposed if the full backs don't protect him when in a 3.
how can the full backs protect him from a long ball over the top?
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:58 pm

Ok....here we go. What's your point now Dawg?

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:59 pm


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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:06 pm

Not saying you're wrong...(god help me if I did), but look at 1:30....Mendy is nowhere near Salah which means Otamendi has to cover for him in a pretty much, no win situation.

If you look at the ball over the top for Mane's red card....Stones and Danilo are the one's who left Mane and played him onside. Otamendi was following Salah. See 2:16.

So ball over the top, I'm thinking, you mean about Calvert-Lewin maybe against EFC? In which case, Pep made several changes to stop that. Oh, and inside the box for the Rooney goal, it was Fernandinho who caused that goal. Stand up instead of jumping in, no cross/pass, no goal.

Be objective and back it up with evidence before being objectionable hey.  Wink

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:23 pm

Your highlights don't show the pass over the top, just the end result.
In your first example, Mendy didn't help but Otamendi was playing 5 yards behind the other defenders which played Salah onside. The next time he steps up because of this (imo) and gets it badly wrong.
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:26 pm

I watched the full match again until the sending off and Otamendi was all over the place. He made at least two bad decisions for offsides. He wasn't at all comfortable with Salah's pace. As we all knew before the game.
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Moonchester on Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:56 pm

im sure on the red from the other angle, Stones and Danilo had a good line with Mane off, and Ottamendi was 8 yards deeper on the near side because he was bobbing it from Salah's pace
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:01 pm

Bobbing it Razz
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:08 pm

Actually, I think he'd just made an offside cock up a few minutes previously
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:18 pm

What decisions did he make wrong, apart from diving in for the Salah free kick?

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:19 pm

Moonchester wrote:im sure on the red from the other angle, Stones and Danilo had a good line with Mane off, and Ottamendi was 8 yards deeper on the near side because he was bobbing it from Salah's pace


Sadly, both of you are wrong. Stones played Mane on....but hey, let's not split hairs about it.  Wink

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Moonchester on Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:39 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDA1vW9usm8

he runs off Stones, but Ottamendi is at the bottom a whole 5 yards deeper...
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:57 pm

My bad...you are both correct. Didn't look like Mane was onside from the angle I saw....but that proves I'm wrong.

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:04 pm

Just paused the video at the moment the ball is played....and Stones steps out....there must be all of less than a yard in it. Not sure he was 5 yards deeper. Wink

But happy to concede that Otamendi was probably the guy who played Mane onside.

I'l happily provide some other points in the game that we were disagreeing about....but hey, don't want to sound 'bitter'.  Razz Razz Razz

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:04 pm

Moonchester wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDA1vW9usm8

he runs off Stones, but Ottamendi is at the bottom a whole 5 yards deeper...
build a bridge moony.....
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:07 pm

Yep...5 yards?  Razz Razz Razz Razz

Do they do Moon shaped bones?  Embarassed

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:10 pm

Dawg's jizzing his pants now I apologised. Shame his bollocks aren't big enough to do that on occasions... Razz Razz Razz

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:29 pm

No need for me to apologise when you're wrong mate. But , it's all about opinions Razz
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:32 pm

I like the way you consistently fail to answer my points then bang on about things that are patently not true and tell us you're the big man for apologising when you were caught out by video evidence and had little choice.
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:33 pm

If you prove me wrong somewhere, I'll gladly apologise or admit my mistake. If you think your opinion is proof, then you're sadly mistaken.
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:56 pm

Topdawg wrote:I like the way you consistently fail to answer my points then bang on about things that are patently not true and tell us you're the big man for apologising when you were caught out by video evidence and had little choice.
Think I asked you earlier to make your points...anything that sort of identifies why you're so 'obsessive' about being right. Do me a favour. Just put them in point form below....then it'll be easier to work out your jibbering.  Razz

1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.

If you need more (probably), just continue. Shouldn't be too hard as a financial expert.  Razz Razz Razz

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:15 pm

good to see you are a counter
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Topdawg on Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:15 pm

in case you can't find the match...

https://highlightsfootball.com/video/manchester-city-vs-liverpool-highlights-full-match/3/
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:18 pm

Got the match recorded on Sky TV....oh, and that link you've just posted has a virus attached (RED screen comes up after clicking - followed by a Locked screen) - SO EVERYONE, DON'T CLICK IT. Rolling Eyes

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Moonchester on Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:19 pm

i don't get any virus warning, but can't get video to load from it.
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:29 pm

See below


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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:31 pm



But the highlights will do fine, even if it doesn't show a still of when the ball was played for the Mane challenge.

1. 2'20 - look at Otamendi having to cover for Mendy, took a yellow for it. Agree with Oz, Salah got a flukey touch.

2. 4'25 - this is Mendy getting caught up the pitch. He has 7 City players in front of him at the end. Salah was 1:1 with Otamendi, who he easily skipped past (just like he did to Mendy), yet Otamendi, even after diving in, is still 20 yards ahead of where Mendy is as the cross comes in. Mendy has to a bust a gut, he's not TLMLF!

3. 4'37 - Mendy, a la Otamendi, but worse, getting skinned by Salah.

4. 5'15 - Otamendi learning from his earlier mistake and standing Salah up, forcing him to cross early and into no-one.

5. 6'15 - Otamendi having to try and cover for Mendy's poor positioning.

So, apart from the Mane challenge, that videos on here don't show the moment the ball was hit forward...these were my points about sticking up for Otamendi, even though he didn't have a great game, and pulling Mendy up for his poor positioning back to support him...prior to the red card.

And now I've just overcooked my Linguine writing this!  No


Last edited by blueboy on Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:39 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

Post by Moonchester on Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:31 pm

Moonchester wrote:anywhere on the pitch he is often a red card waiting to happen.
He does have some good games, just not enough to fill me with confidence in the long run..

Other than being skinned by Salah and bringing him down, and playing Mane onside for kung-fu-academy run he didn't have too much to do himself. he was exposed by Mendy playing very advanced, which was always the danger with Liverpools quick counter threat.
so 30 posts further on you've come to what I said  Surprised))
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Re: City v Liverpool - Live Thread

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