Melton's Article on 606

Really good article on JA 606 - posted by Melton Blue. Certainly more of a plausible reason for Bobby's exit.

http://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/208249

certainly a well presented factual insight into an area which I admit I certainly would not have thought of. If correct certainly does explain a lot and indeed does make the future sound a bit rosier than it did on Tuesday.

It's a good board on ja606,
Some quality posters on it

can someone post the article as i am, unbelieveabley, banned from ja606

Following on from everything that has happened this week, there have been opinions on both sides of the fence on whether it was the right thing to do. On that matter, I am split, but erring towards it was, however one word that has been used a lot is "stability" and why it is so important to have that in the manager. Now, in the very english sense of what a manager is, there is a lot to be said for it, however it is not the be all and end all and I think people need to realise just how much we differ from, say, the United model.

The all encompassing manager who is accountable for everything at the club, from the transfers to the youth intake, is a very English phenomenon and even then, only reserved nowadays for certain clubs. Most foreign teams have not employed this way of working for a long time, instead going down the route of a Director of Football role accompanying what should really be described as a Head Coach rather than a manager. There are pros and cons to either approach, but the mindset on stability and what is actually is required from the individuals involved differs dramatically.

As I said earlier, the best example for stability in a manager has to be United. Having stuck with Ferguson through a few difficult years at the start, they reaped the rewards and have had 20 years of unbridled success, particularly domestically. In that world, for the individual to truly mould everything at the club into what they want it to be, it takes time and stability is absolutely required. Uniteds board knew this, which is why he was allowed those years at the start, he was the manager in the purest sense of the word and reshaped virtually everything at United.

I think a lot of people look at that and therefore think, a manager needs time and stability is the way to go. Now that is true if you want to replicate what happened there, but at the same time, people have to remember that we aren't just talking about any manager, we are talking about one of the best there has ever been. What I would also say is that Fergusons true genius was in squad building and evolution rather than tactics, but because he had full control, he had the platform that he needed.

Since Mancini has been sacked, I have seen a lot of comments from fans of other clubs saying "he hasn't bought good enough players" and "he should have done better considering how much money he has spent", and a lot of that comes from people assuming the role Mancini had at City (considering it had the same title as well) was the same as, say, Fergusons at United. It wasn't, because of the way we set up with a director of football.


In Citys world (and Chelseas, Barcelonas, Real Madrids, PSGs, Bayern Munichs, Dortmunds….i could go on for quite a while here, so that will do!), we have a director of football in Txiki Begiristain, and before that Brian Marwood. Effectively, the role of the all encompassing manager is split between the Director of football and the manager, who is now more of a head coach. The reasoning behind this model is that finding someone like Ferguson who can excel at virtually every facet of managing a club is incredibly rare (just look how high the turnover is in the championship for example, where pure managers are more commonplace).

Instead, what clubs do, and this has been in Europe for a very long time, is make sure that the absolutely key traits required are prioritised, as the roles are more specialist. The director of football is accountable for player acquisitions and making sure all facets of the club are working together (the "holistic" approach talked about in the statement), and the manager is then left to solely concentrate on the first team performance. In the time United have had Ferguson, the other clubs I mentioned have gone through a huge amount of "managers", yet have still been successful, some even more so than United. It is also the reason why a club like Bayern are already buying players before Guardiola has joined - it is not his accountability and not why he has been employed.

Due to the manager having less responsibilities, it means that longevity and stability in that role is far less important. What is needed is complete stability in the Director of Football. If you look at Chelsea, who have been criticised heavily for their chopping and changing, they had had Mike Forde accountable for player acquisitions since 2007 and before that only Frank Arnesen. That is why they have remained successful throughout, they have had stability, people are just looking in the wrong place for it. For the manager, the key traits that they must possess then become tactical knowledge and management of the first team, both in terms of man motivation and picking the team.




What is absolutely critical in this world is that the manager and the director of football are completely on the same page and know and are comfortable with what both of them are accountable for.
In Citys case, two things were always going to go against Mancini. Firstly, when Begiristain was brought in to the role, he was always going to put his own stamp on things. Mancini was not his choice, and it is not surprising that he wanted to bring someone in that he think he could work better with.

Secondly, Mancini has always said how much he wanted Fergusons level of control (and you can see that by just how many of his own people he brought in to the club). As soon as City decided to go down the Director of Football route, it was never going to be the position that Mancini himself fully craved and if you think about what traits that are fundamentally required (man management skills in particular), I'm not surprised by what has happened in the past week.

Mancini will get another job and if he gets one that allows him to have greater control, then I am sure he will do very well. For us, we have to get behind Soriano and Begiristain in particular. He is the man that we need to look for for stability and now that he is bringing in his own man as well, it is time for him to start properly earning his money

thanks wensdi, some good stuff there

Shame melton couldn't be arsed postin it on here aswell

I echo that sentiment.

And where's Vince? He's buggered off as well...

Vince comes and goes sporadically

I think Vince banished himself after the bad language fiasco and the handbags with Blueboy

Jordan wrote:I think Vince banished himself after the bad language fiasco and the handbags with Blueboy

Ey? WTF? I have never, ever had handbags with Vince.....I think you have the wrong fella Jordan. Apologise now...before my handbag gets swung at some serious velocity!!

Bit harsh on Melton guys. I'm sure he only pops over here from time to time - think he just wanted to make a point after he and Ripley's Cat were discussing Bobby's exit. If you read what Ripley has to say on another post then hence Melton's explanation of the set up at City in his post. You would have to read Ripley's post to see why Melton enlightened some posters.

I think we all either tend post on here or 606 - not many do both regularly. Big smilie!!

On the article and not Jordan's misguided lack of situational awareness on this site.....I think I, like others, may have over-looked the point Melton was making.

I for one was happy for Mancini to go.....however, taking Melton's point....I'm not that concerned with him going. We do however, need the 2 Directors of Football to prove why they have been brought in - over the summer with regards to the signings.

Mancini clearly lost the dressing room....the players this season, just did not want to play for him. At times, rarely, we have played some wonderful football.....but it was not consistent, more sporadic.
Players like Yaya, Silva and Aguero haven't looked at their best. Kompany and Hart have dropped on their level of performance from last season. Errors and silly mistakes have crept into our game, as has lethargy and poor finishing.
After 20 games.....we could see that we weren't as sharp in front of goal as last season..........what did we do? Sell Balotelli, but bring no other class forward in to give competition for Aguero and Tevez.

I think if you watch Brian Kidd interviewed after the game on mcfc website......the one player that epitomises effort and drive with our team...is Milner. He was the first player he singled out..and rightly so, but Mancini chose Nasri over him. Now, that is Mancini's choice...not the Directors of Football's choice....so all in all, Melton identified some very important points..........but the decisions on selections and formations was down to one man...Mancini.
Therefore, Mancini had to go no matter how we look at it.

Hi Guys,

Thought I'd better post after reading some of the comments, apologies, I was going to post earlier but I've been out for a few drinks!

To be completely honest, going back to shakens post earlier, as soon as Wendsi posted on JA606, I was going to put the article on here too. As soon as I saw that she had done a link on here already, I've been checking in to see what you guys think for most of the day!

I joined this site within 5 minutes of it being set up and in the early days (before Vince and BWTAC did a bit of work to it, so my rant at Tevez after the Munich game isn't even here) I posted quite a bit, but joined JA606 around the same time as well and over time, stopped posting here.

The reason I joined the old 606 in the first place was because we had just been taken over and getting a lot of negative press, both in the general media but also from other fans. I joined a multi team forum because every article I wrote back then, and even now, were not just for a City fan audience, but hopefully to change the opinion of others on why what we were doing was a good thing for football on the whole, and at its base level, to defend our club.

When this site was first set up, the primary reason was because everyone had had enough of the wums on 606 and wanted to talk about City without the same old crap coming up every time you said anything. The thing is, I realised pretty quickly that was the main thing I got enjoyment out of, not wumming them back, but trying to get them to understand why we were doing the things we were doing and, as I said before, defending our club as much as I could.

Even though I stopped posting, I still look in on here virtually every day, the difference between here and a site like JA606 is that because it is essentially only a City forum, everyone agrees on a lot of the topics involved. Something like what has happened this week is different as it has divided even ourselves as to what we think about what has happened, and that is why I absolutely was going to post on here too just to see what you guys were thinking (and I why I posted on the Pellegrini article the other day).

When this site was setup in the first place, I said to Vince at the time that the problem was it would divide everyone that was on the old 606 between those that wanted to just stick speaking purely to other City fans and those that still liked trying to deal with either the banter or the downright stupidity that other fans would come up with when talking about us. That left the new site (as in JA606) with not that many City fans on it anymore. I personally wanted to keep on posting on a site where other fans could see it and hopefully try and change their mind and to basically keep the flag flying. I completely admit, though, that I should have posted on here more too.

On this article in particular, Wendsi is completely right in that it was a response to what both Ripley and Lee had been saying on JA606 in that Mancini shouldn't have been sacked and that they didn't see a problem with criticising players in public. To be honest, although I wasn't as outright on there, I completely disagreed with that. My own worries about Mancini have gone right back to the Tevez incident in Munich.

What Blueboy wrote here -

"Now, that is Mancini's choice...not the Directors of Football's choice....so all in all, Melton identified some very important points..........but the decisions on selections and formations was down to one man...Mancini.
Therefore, Mancini had to go no matter how we look at it."

That is the crux of the matter for me. We need two traits from a manager in the new world more than anything else. Tactical prowess and man management skills, to make sure they get the best out of the squad that is given to them. For me, Mancini fell short on both and the moment he started criticising other members of the board, let alone the playing staff, his position was untenable.

What is very telling as well, and I didn't have space to write this in the initial article, is that the English media (and Ripley and Lee, to be honest) are of a mindset that we sacked Mancini due to results and that was the wrong thing to do. Now if it was down to results, then I agree, it was the wrong thing to do. However, virtually everyone else in Europe has said that we sacked him despite of the results and are massively commending us for it. 2nd and a Cup final is completely satisfactory to them, they all think we sacked him for the reasons I spoke about in the article (man management skills being the main thing).

There are two points that make me think we are not the new Chelsea and that results are all that matter. Firstly, we asked Platt to stay. It is very rare to sack the manager but not the management team on the whole. Secondly, we want Pellegrini. If results were all that mattered, they would go for someone that has won a lot both domestically and in Europe. They haven't, they have gone for someone that suits what they are trying to achieve, and that more than anything should show that we are absolutely thinking long term.

Hope that all makes sense, as I said at the start, I've had a few drinks!

It's a shame you don't post more on here Melton.....eloquently put, to the point...and above all....objective. Well said fella.....enjoyed reading your opinion.

I'm glad you came on here - albeit with the intention of posting your original 606 post Melton - sorry if I jumped the gun - but I felt so much better about the situation with City after reading it - that I thought it would benefit a few others who were feeling disillusioned about the whole debacle.

Cheers - for an insightful post - and with Patrick taking over the EDS - things do look somewhat rosier in the garden now. Seems like the owners are in it for the long haul and are serious about doing it the right way even though Mancini is the first casualty. As you said it is encouraging they asked Moon Face to stay - I just hope Kidd is persuaded that there is a place for him too.

Can't wait for next season now.

P.S. There are some great posters on 606 - namely Ripley's Cat and a few Reds. There are also a lot of Wums, whingers and immature twits - that repeat the same rubbish daily. I can't be arsed with that.

I too am glad to see you come back melton and thouroughly enjoyed reading your post.

I think your last paragraph really does make you sit up and think about the real reasons RM may have gone.

Pity the PR was done so shabbily
Its as if they cant respond to anything until its cleared from the owner first,thats the only way i can make sense of the deafening silence from the club before & after the cup final

Sorry Blueboy, I've just realised it wasn't you! Ha.

Welcome back Melton. I do pop on 606 now and again and love reading your posts amongst others but rarely comment myself, as it seems if some people disagree you get a backlash of angry internet trolls.

I wish I was that eloquent when I'm sober, never mind after a few scoops!

I find 606 just makes me angry. There are some good posters on there and I enjoy reading their posts, but there are just soooooo many idiots on there - mainly kids who support Spurs or Arsenal, but there's a few red morons too, like that halfjar who keeps mentioning net spend like a broken record - that I just can't be bothered sifting through the dross to get to the gold.

The owners had a 10 year plan when they bought the club. Here are some extracts from around the time they took over.

"We are here as long-term investors, and with our backing, with the
commitment we are going to make to the academy in the next 10 years,
there is going to be a tremendous period for Manchester City and for
us."


“I spent a couple of days visiting Carrington and going to the Academy, I
was there all of Sunday morning and I watched the under 14, under 12
and under 9 sides. One thing that I think is important and that I want
to emphasise straight away, is that the Academy is a priority. We need
to invest in the Academy and we will continue to develop it. It makes
business sense and from a community perspective there is no question
about the impact it has on the community. From the business perspective,
the future of this Club is to continue to produce talents like Micah
Richards, Michael Johnson and Shaun Wright-Phillips. This is very
important to us, and we are really going to commit to the Academy.”

“We are sensible people, and when it comes to a lot of the talk that has
been around recently, forget everything that has been said in the past.
We are sensible people and we are investors who have invested in this
Club and will continue to do so, as long as it has the right pay-off for
us and as long as it delivers results. For us to be happy, this Club
has to be successful, and within a period of time competing at the
highest level and hopefully winning trophies. At the same time, we will
bring in the talent from the Academy and that talent has a value. We’re
convinced of the business case here that in the long-term will pay off.
That’s the bottom line.

How many academy lads have come through in the last 5 years???? None at all. At least last season a few lads got some game time with the 1st team but nothing this season.

City have to be self funding by 2018 and that means academy lads coming through in the very near future.

The whole thing seems geared to being like Barca (no bad thing) with the same style of football through the club from kids to 1st team. When the two Spanish fellas were appointed, I thought the writing was on the wall for Bobby.

So long as he won things (that means League and Champions League) then I could see him carrying on. When results go against you, then you give more ammunition to those that don't want you around.

The sustainability and stability of the club will revolve around the owners and board, not just the manager. Chelsea have proved, in a rather vulgar manner, that stability above the managers' head does win you trophies and can lead to financial self funding.

We are seeing signs of the 10 year plan with the academy development and the talk of increasing stadium capacity to 60,000 maybe even 70,000.

I don't think Bobby fitted into that plan especially the way the team was playing. That he failed twice to get the team out of the group stages of the champs league will have been big nails in his coffin. Regardless of how hard the groups were, a top class team should be getting out of the group.

Fail once, you can get a 2nd chance. Fail twice and it ciao Roberto.

Cheers guys, I'll definitely come on here more often.

Wensdi, I was chuffed to bits to see you had posted it on here already. To be honest, it does take me a while to write them so the more people that look and comment on it really does make my day.

Sunday, I was ridiculously depressed, as I'm sure everyone else was. Just look how far we have come already though under our owners. When Hughes was sacked, I thought it was too soon. Hindsight shows it was absolutely the right call. I trusted the board then, I'm going I do the same now too.

Great post topdawg, btw.

Thanks Melton.

I too was totally depressed on Saturday. Our supporters were depressed during the 2nd half. I've said it before, I can accept paying through the nose (tickets, trains, hotels etc.) to watch City, I can accept getting totally pissed on walking back to the tube and once again when I got to my stop.

What I can't accept is the perceived total lack of effort from the players (I speak collectively) and some puzzling tactical decision making. I can only put the blame on Bobby for that.

I went with my son topdawg and he didn't enjoy any of it. The atmosphere wasn't great, everyone around us was talking about Mancini. Well, either that or throwing up because they had had a few too many beforehand!

The decision that finally changed my mind was taking Tevez off. At that point, I was livid with Mancini.

I must admit, my son and I didn't enjoy it very much either. With the late kick-off, there were too many people who'd had a few too many, the players' perfomances caused the fans around us to start complaining about everything, and after the final whistle there were two altercations right near where we were. One was a lot of shouting and shoving, but another one resulted in punches and blood. And there was me thinking we were all on the same side. I don't think I've ever seen in-fighting by our fans before, it was all a bit weird, like we'd turned into Leeds fans or something.

But on the plus side, we managed to get home an hour and a half earlier than we did after the semi-final!

How is it, everyone you speak to has that exact same thought as regards the Tevez substitution.....yet the most important fella we trust to do the right thing, thinks totally different than us all?

I really am at a loss as to the workings in his mind.

shakencity wrote:How is it, everyone you speak to has that exact same thought as regards the Tevez substitution.....yet the most important fella we trust to do the right thing, thinks totally different than us all?

I really am at a loss as to the workings in his mind.

Maybe he wanted to lose his job - worked his way to a cheeky 4 year contract, loses it in the first year and that's a 3 year compensation payout.

I understand that he isn't getting the full 3 years, but at 7.5m per annum, he will be looking at a hefty sum. Might go live out the rest of his days in Southern Italy with a mojito whilst Plate Face massages his back.

Leo,

I saw some fighting too. I've seen it before, but not for a long time. My son was genuinely scared at one point, which really should not happen in this day and age. Noone coated themselves in glory at the weekend, the club, the players or the fans.

Shaken,

I've had my doubts about Mancinis man management ever since the Tevez incident in Munich, particularly after seeing Zabaleta being interviewed about it. Although at the time I was annoyed at Tevez, something didn't sit right with me. Here was a player that had been the ultimate professional up to that point, giving 100% in every game (and carrying us a lot the season before, in all honesty). Since then, he has been the same and I don't think it was a coincidence that the players started playing free flowing football again last season when he was back in the team.

The more I think about it, the more out of character it was for Tevez, I just did it more likely that Mancini got the wrong end of the stick and ran far too far with it.

Find it more likely, that should say

I'm with you on that topdawg
I've been in the Mancini out camp for a while and I think the straw that broke the camels back for me was away at Southampton
Having seen Southampton batter Utd in the 2nd half at old Trafford the week before it was obvious how they would play against City and we were going to be in a right old battle so surely by now he's learnt the lessons of games at places like Goodison but no and as soon as I heard Nasri & Dzeko in the 11 I knew we were in trouble.A must win game and practically starting with 9 men
The inevitable happened,completely outfought and overrun,Nasri finally changed for Milner when the damage was already done and the title challenge evaporated into the chilly air.
Driving the 4 hours back to Cheshire gives enough time to make sense of your disgust and I felt that if the teams efforts don't mirror the efforts of the supporters who've swerved the opportunity to watch a Saturday evening match on sky to go and support them,then something has to change
For Southampton see Wembley
Never learnt a thing in 3 years,from the days at Goodison where the sub Robinho was subbed himself,about playing any team that play a pressing high tempo game
That's also why he's consistently been outcoached in the Champions league,we are just an easy touch

Oh Soton away. I'd gone golfin in La Manga for a few days with my mates and was biggin up how much we were gonna slap um.....how friggin wrong was is?

Felt so let down, not only by Harts gaff and Barrys own goal, but by the whole 90 minutes......I got the piss taken out of me for most of the night after that.

Shit night

We weren't much better on Saturday than we were against Southampton.

Difference was we won........I couldn't even throw that back at um.

meltonblue wrote:Leo,

I saw some fighting too. I've seen it before, but not for a long time. My son was genuinely scared at one point, which really should not happen in this day and age. Noone coated themselves in glory at the weekend, the club, the players or the fans.

My behaviour on the day was exemplary!

But the whole season has been a mess, aside from the odd game. Every time we played Chelsea, the win at the swamp again and finally winning a league game at the Emirates were all nice things. But when contrasted against the turgid, lifeless performances against Southampton, Sunderland and QPR away, Wigan at home and Reading and West Brom in both games, not to mention the joke of a third round tie in the League Cup, the embarrassing performance in the CL and the final indignity of being stuffed by a soon to be relegated Wigan in the FA Cup final, those performances pale into insignificance. Maybe some fans just can't take a full season of sub-par performances from players who are far more capable when they've spent all afternoon in a pub in Watford getting bloated up on fizzy, overpriced beer.

And yet, in spite of that, we still finished second. If anyone's got any idea how we managed that, I'd be glad to hear it!

It is said that after 38 games you end up where you deserve to be - I say b****ks to that.

We were lucky that Chelsea, Arsenal and Spuds have been pretty tosh too!

Everyone from us down to the bottom, with the exceptions of Swansea (who should be higher) and Wigan (who should be a lot higher), have been a bit crap, really. It's almost as though everyone collectively decided to let bacon face win the title and hope he'd finally quit.

Speaking of the pork belly one, I notice he's won manager of the year. For what, just retiring? I'd have said Rafa was a much better shout for nailing down a CL place, winning the Europa League and all in the face of a fan base who hate him.

I said the same about Rafa, I think he has done a brilliant job, particularly considering the reaction when he was appointed. If I was Chelsea, I would actually prefer to keep him, probably even more than bringing Mourinho back.

I have to agree that Rafa has ended up doing a decent job. He got the major target of top 4 and picked up a cup and a couple of semis along the way. I've not always understood his decisions but I guess they have had so many games and have a smallish squad that he hasn't had too much choice.

And the Chelsea fans booed him relentlessly. Last year they got lucky and won the CL whilst finishing 6th. They were going backwards, it was so obvious and Rafa has brought some stability.

I hope that Pellegrini joins us now and we don't end up with Rafa though!

The thing that struck me most on the day was the disbelief from everybody around me that he'd dropped Pants (no pun intended) for the game. I think everybody agreed that was shocking man-management.
I can't recall such a flat atmosphere at a game as there was in that second half.
Mrs Titbum turned to me at one point and said that the near £600 the day had cost us and the kids could have paid for a nice weekend in Benidorm! How bloody true.
On the positive side, and I do tend to look for a silver lining, I must thank the group of young lads outside The Greyhound for introducing me to the Boyata chant, absolute quality!

TBW, at least my missus doesn't know exactly how much I spent going to the final. She has an idea, but I can't bear to tell her that I spent over £600 for a shite day out.

BTW TBW, what is the Boyata chant???

I was just going to ask the same question TD - but saw that it's on YouTube. I can't post a link at work - soz.

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CDAQtwIwAQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DEhkYb7eSLSM&ei=sVWWUYbUCaz70gW1ioC4AQ&usg=AFQjCNFzlmWad6MEezJwUmbbLDI2dKY45g

That the one?

http://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/208462
Not going well for the Warrington rag ONH

That's the one, quality! My boys jumped straight onto that!
Still makes me chuckle

Paulpowersleftfoot wrote:http://www.ja606.co.uk/articles/viewArticle/208462
Not going well for the Warrington rag ONH

:P:P:P:P

He never learns, does he?

Excellent article, Meltonblue, great stuff - sensible & well thought through. Top follow-up comments as well. I myself wasn't disillusioned after the Final - don't think I've quite shaken off the 'typical City' thing so I just shrugged it off. I think it would've hurt more had we lost it to another top 5 team; but seeing the sheer unadultered joy on the faces of Wigan fans kind of moved me. I still remember being the underdog, snatching a result off one of the Big Boys when it didn't seem possible and I remember how I felt in those moments.

I've always been pro-Mancini but everything changed last Saturday. I was shocked that Pants got dropped. Bob trusted him against Chelsea but didn't trust him v Wigan? But the Tevez subbing finished me; thousands of us can see how bad a decision this was yet the man being paid the big bucks can't. Up to that point I had been mouthing off continuously about the performance; when Tevez went off I just shut up, didn't have any more words to give. Speechless. I mean the signs were there before the Final... like those bemusing post-match comments re Everton about being surprised by the way they played. Again, thousands of us already knew how Everton play against us - yet it took Bobby by surprise. Mystifying. And the Munich bust-up - I decided some time ago that it was probably Mancini overreacting. Not saying Tevez was blameless, he should've bit his tongue and warmed up. It actually looked like he was going to at one point, then sat down again. I still don't like the way he discarded the City scarves in the 2011 Final but since then Tevez has demonstrated 100% commitment to the cause.

I too don't bother with 606; too many trolls. It takes me a while to post on here; I usually just read but I don't like some of the player criticism, it just winds me up & then I stop reading for a couple of weeks to calm down otherwise I'd post something rude. So it's best I go nowhere near 606. I used to post on a movie site and those discussions used to devolve into monosyballic ranting, I grew weary of arguing with trolls - lesson learned. I got banned, actually.

I also hope Brian Kidd stays on in some capacity. He's a genuine bloke and post-Reading his body language was that of a man who wanted to say a little bit more about the shenanigans but couldn't - though he did say something about 'what the players have had to put up with off the pitch' or something, but he kind of ended the sentence abruptly.

Anyone see the bloke outside the City Store on Market St, with his 'Boycott City' message board - and 'in Mancini we trust'... and 'give Mancini his job back'? He probably should have a read of Melton's post...

ONH - the only reason I need to stay away from 606.

Best thing we ever did was vote him off here. Delusional fuckwit.

Cheers disaster, agree with everything to say there too. I want Kidd to stay in any capacity they can find, and I think he will.

Agree with Kidd staying. Manc lad who has the club at heart and he did look genuinely bemused with all that has gone on.
If you think of the managers we have had:

Hughes and Mancini - both disciplinarians. It'd be nice to have a manager that is a man-manager, though still commands the respect of the players - ie Taggert, Mourinho, hate to say it - Wenger.
I just think Mancini's abrasive attitude in his post-match interviews, blaming players for everything - just got to the point where the players were fed up of him.
Rarely, has Taggert blamed the players to the media - he just gets rid of them.
I think players like Hart, Milner, Kompany and Tevez are the players that respond to somebody putting an arm around them and a quiet word in their ear is enough. Publicly criticising them has led to a drop in form in the team.
I will be always thankful for what he delivered to us - 3 trophies, a first PL Championship........but the key time was what he did in the summer. He kept Balotelli when an offer of £40m was being banded around, kept Dzeko, got rid of DeJong and allowed players like Maicon and Sinclair to join the club.
We just didn't progress....and therefore, lethargy sets in unless Mancini can motivate them to win another PL.....he obviously didn't and the team just fizzled out after 20 games.
Shame, but lessons will no doubt be learnt and I cannot wait for the next 2 months to see what happens.

Should never have dumped DeJong - then compound the mistake by buying not one, but two inferior midfielders. Dzeko... I feel sorry for him; I don't want to see him trying to control a ball outside the box with his back to goal, I want to see him steaming onto crosses. If he played for Man United, the way they bang accurate crosses in he'd be getting 20+ goals a season.

Well, he'd score more than Welbeck anyway...

But yeh, the Champs league performance sunk Mancini. The previous season we were unlucky with 10 points but even so, away at Napoli, he persisted with Dzeko who was having an absolute honker and clearly should've been replaced at HT but instead waited till about 10 mins to go before putting Sergio on, then things finally started to happen in their penalty area (with AJ on as well). I'm convinced we'd have got the point we needed had Sergio been on a lot, lot sooner.

It's all ifs and buts. The King is dead; long live the King.