Sunday Supplement..

Watching Sunday Supplement this morning and they are discussing race in football and the issue with the 'space monkey' in the changing room team talk - there is something very ironic about four middle-class white blokes talking about race issues. 

I know it's a sensitive issue, maybe not the best thread to write - but how ridiculous that they all agree that you can't say the word 'monkey' if there are black player in the room. Absolutely absurd. Someone needs to tell these guys that 'monkey' doesn't mean black, nor was it said in that way and perhaps the problem was not the team talk, but the way we construe things. Ridiculous!

A barrel of monkeys
A supplement of arseholes

I totally agree with you Jordan. Don't worry about what you write!

There is a limit to where the line is. Yes you have to be a little careful about upsetting people, what may seem nothing to one man may well offend another.

We can't keep moving the line further away from what is reasonable otherwise we'll just spend our time grunting at each other (though someone will somehow find that offensive too and we won't be able to do that either).

There's so much bollocks about at the moment. Greg Dyke has kind of apologised for the make up of his commission. What wank. If they are the best people, then pick them. He should have apologised for actually having the commission in the first place!

People are walking on egg shells when they don't need to.

My view on the current situation regarding racial abuse is that we've gone beyond tackling out and out racism and have wandered deep into the realm of political correctness.  And all this PC bollocks drives me utterly, utterly mad.  It's partly because the only demographic it serves to pacify is the mid-left nannies that have turned our country into a jellyfish that daren't say anything out of turn in case we find ourselves hated by the rest of the world (and it's a bit late for that, frankly).  But it's mainly because PC only seems to be directed at the White man.  I know the Caucasian race has a lot to answer for, but it's a bit rich when we can be the butt of racial abuse and we have to just suck it up, but we can't use the word "monkey" in the correct context without everyone getting uptight.  PC should apply to everybody or nobody, there's no in between.

Right, rant over.  I've been on my soapbox too much this week.

Totally agree, it's all utter bollocks. We cannot say anything out of turn anymore at the fear of upsetting someone else of different nationality, religion, skin colour, etc, etc..

Alan Shearer was on something over the weekend, and he too said RH shouldn't have said what he did because of how it could be taken. Fuck off you Geordie dick, the bottom line is, RH's not said anything out of turn, it's just some pee-brained pricks that have interpreted it the wrong way and made a racial issue out of it....Arghhh.

Years ago i received an email on this very subject (and when i find it i'll post it on here), basically along the lines of all the "black" things that the world has (which i add is fine)...National Black Awareness Day, the MOBOs etc, etc, yet if we flip it over and alienate everyone by have purely "white" things.....well, by god watch the PC brigade explode into action then.

I laugh at the MOBOs etc.

You can celebrate 'blackness', you can celebrate 'St. Patrick's Day', you can have women only sessions in the gym, you can have a Notting Hill Carnival regardless of the drug taking, muggings and knifings  but you can't easily promote men only stuff or have football commissions that only have white men on them...

for what it's worth....some more words from Martin Samuel:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2469476/Rio-Ferdinand-valuable-Greg-Dyke-commission-FAs-Asian-voices--MARTIN-SAMUEL.html

it is interesting that you just don't see kid of Asian background playing football in the top leagues yet you do see plenty of them playing county cricket and even representing England.

And yet kids with Asian backgrounds love to play football.

We should be encouraging everyone that could play for England to get as far as they can.

If you live in an area with a high population of an Asian community, ie North Manchester as an example - look at somewhere like Goals......there are loads of Asian lads playing 5 a side etc and some very good players out there.

Not sure why they don't seem to progress into football academies......I can't see it being anything to do with the colour of their skin or religious beliefs.....so can only assume it's down to the individuals themselves.....it's a strange one.

Look at the players currently playing in the PL from the MENA region....and who are Muslim.....many, many players.

However, we take the large 'Asian' community residing or being born in the UK - they're mainly from Pakistani, Bangladeshi or Indian families - and all 3 are not known for football.

Middle East/North Africa.....are countries that produce many top players....and are the countries where football is a prominent sport.

Is this a cultural issue then, why England doesn't produce 'Asian' footballers?

In addition; what's the likelihood of them wanting to play for England over Pakistan, Bangladesh, India etc......if they had International teams?

I'm really not sure what the answer is to the problem.

blueboy wrote:
In addition; what's the likelihood of them wanting to play for England over Pakistan, Bangladesh, India etc......if they had International teams?

I'm really not sure what the answer is to the problem.

Leave things as they are....it's simple.

What gets me is when England play these Asian countries at one-day Cricket, whether it be at OT, Headingley, Edgebaston, etc, etc....despite being English and bleating to all and sundry how English they are, they quickly put on their Pakistan/India one day strips and support against us.

shakencity wrote:

blueboy wrote:
In addition; what's the likelihood of them wanting to play for England over Pakistan, Bangladesh, India etc......if they had International teams?

I'm really not sure what the answer is to the problem.

Leave things as they are....it's simple.

What gets me is when England play these Asian countries at one-day Cricket, whether it be at OT, Headingley, Edgebaston, etc, etc....despite being English and bleating to all and sundry how English they are, they quickly put on their Pakistan/India one day strips and support against us.

That's my point. Their identity clearly lies with their families country of origin. I guess it will take further generations being born here, to parents who were born here for them to identify with the UK being part of their heritage.

Maybe not.

Blue I emigrated to oz in 1996 but I could never support Australia over England  / UK irrespective of the fact I live here. My daughter was born here and does support Australia in sports. Her choice. With Indians , Pakistanis etc they tend to be very family oriented and still have a respect for parental wishes which may answer why some do not follow a career in football. How many become Doctors lawyers, etc academic studies seems to take precedent over sport. I am not sterotyping them all and some families rule with almost a fear factor. My wife was at uni In Leicester and shared a house with 3 indian girls and the stories she has told me and I have seen 1st hand of parents disowning their daughters, one even trying to kidnap his own daughter.

It's a mixture of different things.

Some parents just won't allow sport to interfere with their studies.

Some parents can't afford to support their advancement in sports especially if they are engaged in less well paid work.

Some kids just don't want to mix because they aren't used to it.

Where I grew up, the West Indian kids fitted in, the Pakistani, Indians and Bengalis didn't. The cultures were very different (no alcohol, no meat at all or halal meat for instance).

You'll never get around the cricket issue though!

I have lived in the USA for 20 years now,but my allegiance is still with the UK because it is inborn and perfectly normal in my opinion.To get back to the original topic,on TV over here there is a black channel and all the programmes and actors are black,no whites whatsoever,yet on the so called white channels if a programme come on with no black actors in it there is hell to pay and there is talk of racial discrimination.Where is the equality there?