Burnley vs City - Live Thread

[blueboy]

First topic message reminder :

Will Sergio be fit? Will TLMLF get another game? You'd have to say after he scored 2 goals last week, it'd be hard for another Manager to leave him out - but this is Pep!

For me:

Bravo
Sagna, Stones, Ota, Clichy
Fernandinho, Gundogan
Sterling, Silva, KDB
Aguero

[blueboy]

Den said Sterling was shit - last season. He's been one of our better players this season and won POTM award! They are still young and especially Sane, he's moved to a new league, new manager etc - so he should be given time before he's judged on his sparse appearances.

He may turn out to be shit - but I'm happy to wait until he's played 4-8 games from the start - then I'll have an objective opinion of his ability - but until then, I'll reserve judgement on him.

[Topdawg]

You can reserve judgement on him. Last season, Sterling wasn't great. Pretty crap at the end. Maybe that was Pellegrini's fault. Maybe it was Raheem's.  Who knows. We can only go by what we see.

Sane has been on the pitch for 40% of our games. He hasn't done anything of real note. Maybe's he's not had a lot of time, but time is precious. He hasn't made the most of the time he's had and isn't worth a spot when we are struggling to win a game.

[Moonchester]

can you stop throwing 40% of games in..
show me % of minutes played as far more accurate stat.

[Topdawg]

It's like throwing the you said hea shit quote when I never said it. Regardless of how many minutes he has or hasn't played, he's not really done anything of note

[Moonchester]

he set off on fire against Everton in the first half, then he seemed to be told to change tactics after that.
He's set up a couple of goals when he's come on.

Not really a let-down,
but surprising amount of time he's been on the pitch given what we paid for him..

[blueboy]

Agree.

He's been 'involved' in 6 PL games this season.

Stats (mins on the pitch):

30' v United
18' v B'Mouth
3' v Spurs
71' v EFC
90' v Soton
33' v Burnley

2 PL starts and 1 Cup start.

212 PL mins on the pitch - that's less than 3 whole games.
Goals: 0
Assists: 2

Remember - he plays in a position where he's being asked to hug the touchline...and I agree, I thought he was excellent against EFC - so it's not comparable to Kelechi and his stats as a sub.

[Topdawg]

I'm not comparing him to Kelechi as he's spent a little time with us already and he did play a few times last season.

I'll ignore the Spuds game as 3 minutes isn't enough time. Is 18 minutes enough time? 30 minutes surely is enough to show something.

Let's not mix our stats shall we.

He may have had 247 PL minutes (inc. Burnley), but he only has one assist according to Premier League stats. He's had 11 minutes in the CL (one assist) and 153 minutes in the League Cup.

So far this season, he's had 411 minutes (4.5 games) and provided 2 assists.

His PL minutes means he's played 21% of total PL minutes.

I'll agree that Pep had him hugging the touchline all the time. He took Pep's orders to heart.

Maybe it's Pep's fault

[blueboy]

So, for a winger, according to your stats, he has two assists in 4.5 games.

What exactly would warrant a 'pat on the back' for you in 4.5 games as a winger who hugs the touchline? 5 goals, 5 assists? 

[blueboy]

But you mentioned Kelechi as an argument and comparison to Sane, saying how he comes on and scores - even though one is a striker with PL experience, the other has made sporadic appearances.

If you take Navas - who now has 3/4 years PL experience:

107 games
4 goals
22 assists

Sane

6 games
0 goals
2 assists

All I'll say is: "give him a chance - and judge him when he's had a decent run-out in the team, starting matches"....and if he's shit, then you're right and I'll be wrong.

[Topdawg]

I don't remember ever comparing him to Kelechi. Of course, if I have, you can point it out to me. 

I'll happily say Navas is shit.

If Sane end up being shit, I'm not right as I haven't said he's shit. There you go again, putting words into my mouth. It wasn't bad enough that you got the stats wrong...

And you're still getting your stats wrong

[blueboy]

Ahh, so as a person with a vestige interest in accountancy and stats, that's how you judge a player now?

If his goals, crosses, to passes and assist ratios don't compare to others, he must have played shit! Or is a shit player (think I've cleared that one up on numerous occasions - and you chose 'ambiguity' as an explanation) Right, I get it now...oh well, if it's stats you're interested in, I won't bother - you win. 

[blueboy]

I don't remember ever comparing him to Kelechi. Of course, if I have, you can point it out to me. 

I'll happily say Navas is shit.

If Sane end up being shit, I'm not right as I haven't said he's shit. There you go again, putting words into my mouth. It wasn't bad enough that you got the stats wrong...

And you're still getting your stats wrong

I never mentioned Kelechi, nor did I compare Sane to him - unlike you - you did initially to justify another players inclusion ahead of Sane....just saying:

do your research (i know you're good at it) and show me where i've said he's shit? I've said he's done fuck all or played shit. he's not shown me anything to say why he should get time in front of,say, kelechi who has actually scored and set up goals, even when he's only been on the pitch for a few minutes.

[blueboy]

But hey...it's all about opinions rather than "he said, you said, I said"....but if you ask me to show the evidence, I will...

[Topdawg]

Yes, and I stand by what I said. You'll keep on taking what I said in isolation and out of proper context. You'll rely on 'ambiguity' when you are wrong and you'll use stats when you think they support your case, even when your stats are wrong, and then laugh at my using stats. Even though you wanted to use stats when you thought they supported your case. As with your incorrect stats as to how many PL assists Sane has. And how many minutes he's actually played. But that's your choice.

By the way, your stats were wrong. Not sure if you noticed. Certainly didn't mention them when I pulled you up on it.

And you still haven't shown where I've said Sane IS shit. You keep banging on about it. I've said he's played shit. If Aguero takes a poor penalty, and you call him out on it, is it right to say that you said he's poor??? Or would it be more accurate to say he took a poor penalty?

Enough of this now. This is circular.

Sane doesn't deserve even as much time as he's got.

[blueboy]

Oh snowflake, stop being so sensitive!

[leopold]

So much for getting behind the team...

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